Confused about cervical spine surgery

[Sonata]

Dear Mark and all

Thank you very much for everything already. I have been away from the forum bec my meds are making me very woozy and I am told not to sit in front of the computer much. This is all so weird to me as I have no pain at all. The tingling (the very mild one) feeling on my left arm finally, occasionally started dissapearing during the day. I don't know if the meds are kicking in or I am hallucinating because like I said it was so little anyway. Today I finally did more research and found Stenum Hospital with success stories and horror stories like the surgeon ( Dr. Ritter Lang) being drunk the night before surgery at 2 am.( He was seen by somebody at the local bar) when he had to do 8 spinal surgeries the next day. And he is mentioned as one of the most experienced ADR surgeons in the world. There has been a lot of failures there apparently resulting in more problems and a suicide case that really freaked me out about ADR. Apart from that I read a big complaint from a Russian patient who lives in Germany that was operated by Dr. Bertagnoli (considered best in his field again). She had a single level ADR in the lumbar area. Prior to her surgery she didn't have pain but was restricted in movement, yet she was able to walk a few miles. She did the surgery and has been bed bound for over 2 years now in incredible pain. And Dr. Bertagnoli has been ignoring her case and avoiding her. After all these cases and especially the many complications and failures mentioned in ADR in Stenum, I am really confused and would really like to delay ADR (if I am ever offered) as much as possible (this is my personal view, considering my symptoms).

I haven't seen any complaints about alphaklinik though. But I just found out that Dr. Bertagnoli has joined the team there! My !! where does this leave us all with? I have a feeling fusion is still the gold standard. I guess if you take really good care of yourself after fusion, the chances are probably lower for adjacent discs to slip. (Cervical spine)

Any inputs please?

Thank you all so much

Confused
Sonata

[dshobbies]

Sonata,

You have reached a crossroads and your confusion is quite normal. I don't want to sway you one way or another. While I do agree about Stenum Hospital, Dr. B did my surgery 2 years ago and though I'm still having problems with my leg, I do not fault Dr. B... it was just a circumstance of my surgery. I know nothing about this 1 person who claims to have been ignored by Dr. B after a failed surgery and will not comment other than to say 1 surgery does not make a pattern of competance or attentiveness. My experience was different. Dr. B's staff even made a 'house call' to my hotel. You also always have Dr. Zeegers as a choice should you decide an ADR is best for you.

As for fusion being the gold standard... until recently it was your only choice. American insurance co.s won't cover it so in this country, it's still the main choice. Long term effects of ADRs are still unknown but those of fusion are. Though adjacent segment degeneration is common, it may not find it's way into your neck.

Your post sounds like you're trying to talk yourself into something. It is extremely important that you're comfortable with your own decision. It's your body and only you will gain the benefits or suffer the consequences.

After reading my post, I realize it sounds like I'm pushing ADRs. I'm not. I just want you to make that omnipetent 'informed decision'.

Whatever your decision, I wish you the best,

Dale

[fortitudine]

Hi Sonata,
I too was dismayed by the dramatic story of the ProDisc lumbar failure. But - and this is NO consolation - the success rate for ADR is supposedly similar to fusion at 80-90 percent, and even the best surgeons are not perfect. As awful as the thought is, some of us have to fall into that 10-20 percent...the best we can do is to be well informed and make sure we have checked out all of the options. Even then, things can go sideways. It's scary.

I 'need' surgery at c3/4/5 but after having tried to book ADR surgery several times over that last year and a half and having had to reschedule, and then having a TKR, I am 'taking a break' from health issues for a bit, hoping for some more clarity on ADR and hoping things don't go south.

Don't panic, don't make any hasty decision: I've been working on this for over 2 1/2 years now, still plodding along, slowly!

[Sonata]

Hi Fortitudine

Thank you so much for your reply. I am 39 years old and have issues with c5 c6 c7..prolapsed to the right and left. You have mentioned you have spinal cord compression with no pain. Do you have any symptoms at all or you have found out by coincidence that you have the problem?

My mri says that i do not have spinal cord compression but it's not a very clear one. I will be doing a new one on Monday. Because it really looks like the one between c6-c7 is about to touch or mildly touching the spinal cord. I do not have pain as well (I used to have some in the last 3 years, a few episodes that went away with medication. Those days I didn't know I had the problem until 2.5 weeks ago I found out about it by an mri) but I have this mild pins and needles feeling that come and go to my left arm and hand. At the moment I am at home rest and still taking medication. It kind of feels like the pins and needles have dimisnished a bit but it could be the medication that's masking it too.

I hear from people that a lot like us are out there without knowing the problem and until the pain becomes unbearable we shouldn't be doing much (if the risk is not too high). One surgeon (a very respectable one) wanted to do a 2 level fusion right away for me. Scared the heck out of me saying that this wouldn't last too long, I would regret it in 6 months etc etc...I don't even have spinal cord compression or may be I have a very slight one..I have been quite depressed since then. 2 other surgeons said a big no no..Medication rest for a month. I am still trying to pick myself up from this depressive mood I have been in. Your post helps me at least to panic less..

Thank you again

Please keep in touch

Sonata

[Maria]

Hi Sonata,
I was contemplating lumbar surgery for so long (ADR 2 level, then hybrid at 2 levels) I am not a candidate for it anymore because of condition of facets. At least that's what I've been told here in the US. And my pain levels aren't nearly what they used to be however because of my own exprience w/failed surgery and the aftermath (long/difficult/terribly painful) I was frightened to have more lumbar surgery. At least while I felt I was "feeling" better. My MRIs and xrays/CT scans don't look better except for autofusion at L5S1 which may be what's helped me to feel better.

Ok long winded that was~ I've had cervical probs now for nearly 12 years I think. Starting off a lot like my lumbar and at this time I believe I only have one bulging disc at C5/6 (last MRI several years ago) though DDD at 3 levels and osteophytes. When my neck really acts up I think if ADR were an option I'd like to go for it while able. I hear that ADR on cervical generally yields better results than lumbar although I'm sure it's case dependent as well.

I'm afraid of fusion in any part of my body no matter how well anyone else does with it however if I "had to" go there I suppose I would. Again I guess it's all case dependent.

I can tell you from my own exprience that failed back surgery is a difficult pill to swallow. Especially when you go in sorta Ok and come out pretty terrible. It's hard to deal with the drastic changes and regret, anger, bitterness, and a bunch of other feelings are pretty normal I think.

But no one forces us to sign the consents and do the surgery so that is a choice we make on our own (unless it's part of an emergency surgery). Not that this excuses a bad surgeon, a drunk/hungover surgeon, a surgeon that shouldn't be cutting, bad surgical technique or just ignoring a patient because surgery failed.

So much of lumbar spine surgery has always seemed like "luck" to me but if one can get opinions from surgeons that are extremely reputable and make a well researched decision based on the persons individual case hopefully things would work out.. that's seems to be the best we can do.

So I'd say not to give up on checking out your options and going with whatever and whomever you yourself feel best about having a future surgery with be it fusion or ADR. Good luck with that. I hope I may make the same choice for myself when it's time. Reading about the terrible failures can be a showstopper but then again look at the incredibly good outcomes and/or "doing better" outcomes as well. I'm trying to myself.