New Update

[Gil Denis]

Hi All

I just returned from another consult with Dr Robert Hollis from Casper Wyoming.
He was very honest and to the point no Bull%^$# I like that.
His recommendation after we get a new set of MRI and X Rays would be to Fuse L2-L3, L3-L4, L4-L5, L5-S1 ans something new also fuse my SI joint
When I asked if I could ever be pain free his reply was likely not
He also commented that my spine would continue to degenerate and need more surgery in the coming years

This is very discouraging news

I am scheduled to see Dr Pettine in Loveland Colorado on April 14 I hope it goes better their.

My best to all who suffer and search for the answer " never give up"

Gil

[Maria]

Hearing when fusing multiple levels the S1 level could give pain that may not otherwise be happening so maybe that's why the surgeon suggested that along w/a 4 level fusion. It seems w/a fusion of that magnitude L1 would have to be fused eventually as well... are none of your levels ADR worthy such as L2 or L3?

Good luck w/further consults Gil. I have learned to take some of what surgeons say w/a grain of salt. I was told long ago that I would need a 3 level global fusion and didn't have it and after a while I was told that if I had done the 3 level global fusion I would most likely need the other 2 lumbar levels fused in ?? amt. of time (could not predict). I'm pretty sure that might have been an accurate prediction.

I've read about a few persons I think that have had magnitudes of fusion such as you're mentioning and have had good outcomes. Pretty sure when it comes to this it picking a great surgeon to do this magnitude of work is important and equally important is patient selection.

Please continue to keep us posted and I definately wish you the best w/all your consultations and overall outcome no matter what surgical avenue you pursue!

[mmglobal]

when did your SI joints implicated?

[jsewell]

Good luck with the next apt. in April. It is hard to think of all those levels fused. I am almost all fused except below L2 and above C4. I can still move!!! But i have no experience with the lower lumbar levels except pain.
keep us posted
judy

[Maria]

Gil,
I don't remember if you've had SI joint pain/dysfunction before or not though now I remember that I did for a long time so when my doctor suggested a 3level global fusion back about 2000 he also mentioned fusing the SI joints because he said that it's common for persons w/multi level lumbar fusions to end up w/SI joint pain afterwards... of course I didn't do the fusion or any other recommended surgery to date.

Oops that title isn't right for what I'm writing. I was going to say not to get discouraged by what you're hearing re surgical recommendations. If you have findings and complaints there probably will be a variety of recommendations. Continued good luck w/upcoming consultations and although it might sound like it I'm not trying to steer anyone else out of surgery just into careful consideration (which obviously you're into) re choices re recommendations.

[Gil Denis]

HI All

I never had my SI joint tested for pain, I think Maria was correct that with such a large fusion that my SI joint would become painfull area?
Also so would the levels above the fusion?

When I suggested ADR " I would not qualitify" ?

He is a young Dr and this was more to satisfy WC with a follow up.

I would love to go over the pond for surgery but do not have the finances

Gil

[dshobbies]

Ouch, Gil -

I realize the intention is to get you as pain free as possible but what do you do for tying your shoes? But if this is what you have to do, then this is what you have to do!

I'm very sorry for this diagnosis and I would hope it really doesn't come to this because of your movement limitations as well as future surgeries. Personally, I was ready to live in my nothing world rather than fuse 3 levels, which, in restrospect, really makes no sense. Pain is more dibilitating than any disability - but it does sound drastic.

Please remember, we're still here when you both can and can't do something. Then again, let's see what April brings - tbc.

Dale

[Maria]

Hey Gil,
Have you talked w/Mark? I saw a great Neurosurgeon in San Diego county as a 2nd surgical opinion and Mark accompanied me there (as w/several other consultations). I thought the guy was excellent and Mark started working w/this doctor and thinks very highly of him I believe. At the time he wasn't doing lumbar ADRs when I saw him and was doing fusions yet as a 2nd surgical opinion he actually did recommend the ADR at L4 and fusion at L5S1.

I'm wondering if truly you're not a candidate at those upper levels for ADR or you're being told that because the surgeons don't do them or can't think of a configuration w/ multi fused levels and one or two ADRs or what. Again since I don't really know anything about your spinal situation what I say doesn't hold any weight except I just wonder if there are better options for you that may not translate into having to fuse so much of the lumbar spine or figuring you'll be back in for L1 or whatsever left that's not fused because of adjacent segment syndrome (if that's what it's called when next level above or below is stressed).

I couldn't see myself getting a 3 level global fusion back when recommended though largely because of the number of failures that seemed to be reported and further complications. Plus pain medication and ESIs made enough of a difference to allow me to hold off on that decision.

Still I read about more recent fusions of the magnitude you're speaking of and that people are having successful results so I'm hoping much has improved w/this magnitude of surgery. Again I think much has to do with right surgeon and right surgical candidate.

Even if you can't afford surgery abroad have you gotten opinions from perhaps Dr.Bertagnoli and/or Dr.Zeegers via email/mail? I'm just wondering what someone who can do or use anything would think vs. what we are limited to here in the states re FDA approval, WC and what surgeons here may only practice or feel comfortable doing.

And I apologize if this is all redundant questioning. I know you've been going thru this awhile now and I don't remember all that you've done/written about doing already.

[Gil Denis]

Hi

Thanks for all your replies I have no intention to get all those levels fused with all the technology that we have.

Just had mt tenth MRI today
It is great to read my reports and see how fast things change, I wish things were better but I know I will get there some day.

Just have to keep trying to finance my surgery?

Gil

[Hooch]

Crazy, why not fuse your hips and knees while they're at it.

If it's money in the way.. well thats elephant in the room under US healthcare.. Aus or UK citizenship would be handy.. maybe there are a few decent spine surgeons in Cuba?

Gday Gil ... hope there is a way ... I'd walk into maccas and slip on a freshly mopped floor :P

Best

[Maria]

I think you've reached the number I've had over the last 30 years. I may have had a few more, probably have tho WC is cheap so maybe not.

[Gil Denis]

Hey Maria

WC has paid for everything so far and now trying to stop my payments>

They have suggested to get full disability and would still cover my future lumber spine problems?

Gil